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World Community Grid Forums
Category: Support
Forum: BOINC Agent Support
Thread: Tired and frustrated - time for leaving? |
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Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 51
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KerSamson
Master Cruncher Switzerland Joined: Jan 29, 2007 Post Count: 1664 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Since January 2007, I participate to WCG grid computing projects exclusively.
----------------------------------------I supported all available projects with a particular (but not only) focus on HCMD Phases 1 & 2. Since the coming of VINA based projects, I experienced regularly problems with invalidated WUs. I mentioned such troubles several times (and I am not the only one who did it). The troubles are recurrent with AMD based hosts running Linux. Since no real solutions have been proposed, I avoided more and more VINA based projects. We are now in a very frustrating situation. Since FAAH is moving to VINA, the numbers of invalid WUs is increasing dramatically. It looks like that nobody does really take care of this problem. Some WUs are OK, some others are invalid: that's it !!! Only CEP2 remains available and reliable, even with a lot of constraints and restrictions. There is no clear communication on WCG's side regarding VINA and AMD (especially for Linux based hosts). At this time, we do not know which new projects will/would/could come and which computing agent will be used in the future. Regarding the electricity costs and the constraints induced by a 24/7/365 WCG involvement, I am - for the first time - seriously considering to leave WCG and to stop any grid computing engagements. I do not have electricity for free, the couple of hosts I devoted to WCG require to be bought and maintained. I am tired to offer resources for invalid results. If I take time for writing today, it is because I have the feeling that I am probably not the only one experiencing such problems and such frustration. I did not take already my final decision. However, I would appreciate to be able to read/receive a clear statement about WCG future and about the support of the coming projects (especially if VINA should become the standard computation agent or not). Yves --- FYI: I have 20 AMD based cores and only 8 Intel based cores; Linux is used for 16 cores, WinXP Pro for 12 cores. |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Sigh,
Wish you well KerSamson. Just know how frustrated I am when this issue was highlighted as upcoming BEFORE the AD Vina version launch. At least knreed posted that a redesign of the project selection sections is underway, so also sub versions can be chosen, even maybe platforms [In my dreams]. Also I saw a developers post that a Web profile for Android is in development... the standard just does not fit. When that comes to WCG... The Egyptians have a great saying, which translates as "If Allah wants, tomorrow, maybe". [Think Adamo had a song like Insh'Allah... in our dreams too] VINA becoming the standard... don't think so. The current fav for certain molecular docking researches which the next project is definitely not doing. That said, I you want to donate your computing capacity, there are so many other projects worthy of considering such as SIMAP, which is apparently now on a continuous crunching stream [CEP2 type bandwidth use IIRC... large results relative to the computing time.] |
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gb009761
Master Cruncher Scotland Joined: Apr 6, 2005 Post Count: 2955 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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I, too, wish you well KerSamson.
----------------------------------------It's crunchers such as yourself, who've put in a lot of time and effort (all voluntarily), who I really think WCG/IBM should think off when they decide to reconsider their "silent" treatment towards all crunchers. After all, it is a two way street, one where communication from both sides is possible without giving away 'too much of the game'. I really do hope that, the next thing that's going to happen, is the launch of a new project or two - and that's a project which doesn't involve VINA and/or huge constraints on systems which rule out only those who are really serious (24/7) crunchers - after all, even if DSFL/SN2S came back tomorrow, that'd still be no good for people such as yourself.  |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Hang in there Yves, keep the faith. I have been here longer than you and am still prepared to trust WCG....
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cjslman
Master Cruncher Mexico Joined: Nov 23, 2004 Post Count: 2082 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Yves, I also wish you well. Some of the points you have presented have been worked on:
----------------------------------------Since FAAH is moving to VINA, the numbers of invalid WUs is increasing dramatically. It looks like that nobody does really take care of this problem. Some WUs are OK, some others are invalid: that's it !!! The problem (which was with FAHV 7.03) has been taken care of with FAHV 7.06 (BTW, I just processed my last v7.03 today). As for VINA becoming the standard for FAH, I don't think so... VINA is only good for some of the experiments. True, WCG projects are at a low right now (for various reasons) and I'm sure that there will be other projects (both new and restarts of currently stopped projects) soon enough (plenty has been discussed about this). Now... some questions you might want to ask yourself: who is helping whom? If you leave WCG, who will be affected? As for the cost of the electricity... maybe only crunch when the computers only need to be on (don't leave them on 24x7). That way, you're still contributing at a lower cost for you. Whatever your final decision is, I wish you luck... live long and prosper. CJSL Gotta keep crunching.... there's a world to save !!! |
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gb009761
Master Cruncher Scotland Joined: Apr 6, 2005 Post Count: 2955 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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cjslman, I do believe KerSamson's issue, is with the AMD cores throwing a 'wobbly' every now and again (by the sounds of it, it's more 'now' than 'then') when running VINA based projects - which results in errors/wasted time, effort and ultimately, electricity. This has been a reoccurring issue for a very long time with the VINA based projects (as can be witnessed in the GFAM/DSFL & SN2S forum's) - it's not just a recent phenomenon.
----------------------------------------I suppose, one way around it, could be to pump CEP2 WU's through the AMD devices and FA@H through the Intel processors - at least, until the option to chose which FA@H application to run, becomes available (at which point, the Autodock FA@H could also be run on the AMD processors). [Edit 1 times, last edit by gb009761 at Jul 29, 2013 12:25:47 PM] |
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OldChap
Veteran Cruncher UK Joined: Jun 5, 2009 Post Count: 978 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Because app_config settings seem not to be seen by the servers sending work My suggestion would be to create a new Vina project separate from the normal faah one. It would resolve issues for quite a few people.
----------------------------------------KerSamson: Take a summer holiday  A month or two off might let you rest your machines and give you a break too. I understand that it is much nicer when you can run and forget those machines so maybe in a while you could come back refreshed to some new projects or to some changes that take into consideration the issues faced by some folks. |
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Sorry to see you go Ker but it is understandable. Your contributions, comments and posts to WCG have been very helpful over the years. Many thanks to you.
----------------------------------------It is time for a transfusion of new blood in WCG management. The project needs new personnel with new ideas, new energies and some basic communication skills. I left WCG some time ago but I continue to help map the universe, look for binary pulsars and gravitational waves as well as helping to find near-earth objects which could give the earth a "bad day". Each person has to decide for themselves "if" and "what" to crunch. Chose wisely. Cheers crunchers.  PS: What ever happened to the WCG Satisfaction survey? Dust in the wind?   |
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jonnieb-uk
Ace Cruncher England Joined: Nov 30, 2011 Post Count: 6105 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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PS: What ever happened to the WCG Satisfaction survey? Dust in the wind? Last heard of Apr 12, 2013 when ErikaT posted: .....it will probably take us several weeks to go through and analyze all of the information we've gathered. We do plan on sharing the key findings with you all at some point in the future, so stay tuned! 16 weeks later (& 20 weeks since the survey closed) we're still tuned in but only getting white noise.  Subsequently on May 9 jhindo responding to concerns raised by ericinboston (re the abrupt end of HCC) posted: We're starting to think about our communication strategy: what to notify members about ..... I have to say that, other than the welcome improvement in the use of Notices via BOINC Mgr, little seems to have changed. Users still being treated as mushrooms. |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
....if you think this is bad you should have been around at the end of UD (Grid.org)! Then you would know what being a mushroom truely means
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